The Saracens of Biddulph Moor
There has been a legend that has persisted over the years and does not show any sign of going away, and that is that the people of Biddulph Moor in the county of Staffordshire are thought to be descendants from a group of Saracen Stonemasons brought back to this area by a person known as Orm of Biddulph.
The people of Biddulph Moor are known to have more exotic dark features than most people living in the surrounding area, and with the difference in dialect, this does seem to set these people apart from their neighbouring communities.
It is thought that Orm brought back seven Saracen Stonemasons and their descendants became the Bailey family whose children had the “most lovely shades of red hair”.
There are however some disputed facts surrounding this legend, there is thought to be an Eastern influence in the construction of St Laurence’s church in Biddulph which was thought to have been founded by Orm, and the Eastern influence would no doubt be due to the Saracen Stonemasons who would have been used in its construction.
St Laurence’s Church in Biddulph
There is a strange Font in nearby St Mary’s church, which would have originally been sited at St Laurence’s church and which some people believe originally came from Palestine and if this were true it would strengthen the story considerably.
The first appearance in print with reference to the story appeared in Sleigh’s “A history of the ancient parish of Leek” in 1862 and is as follows: “One of the Lords of Biddulph, a Knight Crusader, is reputed to have brought over in his train from the holy land a Paynim whom he made Bailiff on his estate, and from whose marriage with an English woman the present race of “Biddle Moor men” is traditionally said to have sprung. Probably this infusion of Saracenic blood may account fot their nomadic and somewhat bellicose propensities”.
The Biddle Moor people as they were originally known were mentioned by a woman by the name of S. Burne in 1909 in connection with the North Staffs Field Club after she had visited them. She had this to say about them, claiming that they had “Oval faces, brown ruddy complexions, and hair in shades of auburn”. Burne claimed that they were descended from twelve Saracen captives brought back by the Lord of Knypersley (Orm) from the third Crusade. Burne goes on to suggest that they may have been Gypsies, so this may yet be another variation to the story.
It has been suggested that St Laurence church has some sort of connection with the Knights Templars mainly due to the fact that there can be found a series of stone coffin lids around the sides of the church which have a sword and cross on them.
Knights Templar coffin lid?
The sword and cross is representative of the Knights Templars however there is a dispute as to whether or not they are connected to the Templars as some people are of the opinion that they are of a Norman style, so the jury is still out on this debate.
These coffin lids can be found all around the outside of the church
Hi! It seems to be the right place to get the info i need. Thanks
JimCoffee10 said this on January 2, 2011 at 12:42 am |
I love your blog, you should add an RSS feed feature so I can get automatic notifications of new blogs. If you set one up please email me! i will bookmark you for now. Again Excellent Blog!
Canon Ink Jet Printer said this on October 17, 2011 at 9:28 am |
Ah, the Biddulphs. I am actually directly related to these people. My great grandfather, Abe Joel, was highly regarded in those parts.
ERIC STANWAY said this on May 19, 2012 at 1:13 pm |
Thanks for sharing this information with us Eric. Regards Gary
blakemere said this on May 19, 2012 at 4:49 pm |
I am interested in learning more about the Saracens as I think some of my DNA may include their DNA
Chris Heath, said this on June 28, 2012 at 10:31 pm |
Hi Chris,
Who did you have your DNA tested with? I had mine done with Ancestry. It would be interesting to see if we had any kind of match. I don’t have any direct Bailey ancestors but my grandmother’s people came from Biddulph Moor.
Victoria
Victoria Horton said this on December 18, 2019 at 5:38 pm |
I I am from Biddulph Moor, I do have descendants from the Bailey family but haven’t had a DNA test yet.
Ian Kirkham said this on March 12, 2024 at 6:22 am |
I have just read Michael Woods BBC report on Britain’s first black community. I think he should have included Biddulph. I am also descended from one of the Baileys.
Charlotte S said this on July 20, 2012 at 8:14 am |
Both my parents were Baileys living in Leek as their ancesters moved from Biddulph Moor in the 1800s. I always heard both versions of the legend wnd we were very proud to think we were descended from Saracens. If Dad wanted to annoy Mum he substituted the Gypsy story
Jenny hart nee Bailey
Jenny Hart said this on December 4, 2012 at 8:16 pm |
My mother is a Bailey, lived on Biddulph moor from birth born 1937. Hewr parents came from Leek. Lenard and Anne Bailey.
ianrkirkham said this on March 12, 2024 at 8:18 am |
If any more Baileys read this blog please leave a comment. My relatives were stone masons and built some of the houses in Biddulph. Apparently there were different clans of Baileys, I am from the ‘Pinkies’ there were Bluies and Brownies too. Has any one else heard this info?
Charlotte S said this on December 7, 2012 at 10:02 am |
Hi Charlotte…my dad is a Bailey from Biddulph Moor, and has been looking into this in some detail. I think I am also descended from the ‘Pinkies’ and yes, I’ve heard of the Bluey’s and also the Cabbage Baileys!
Annaliese said this on April 28, 2015 at 10:28 pm |
There was a cobbler known as Harry Cabbage (surname actually Bailey) who made traditional leather clogs with wooden/metal soles. I grew up on Biddulph Moor and we used to get Harry to make us thick leather watch straps with metal studs :-))). He lived in a tiny low ceilinged cottage on Eliases Lane near its junction with Hurst Road. He had a really bad limp said to be the result of a motorbike accident. He was always great with us (I’d be about 10 in 1977 when we used to go there). Harry did have an olive skin and dark eyes from what I remember.
Jonathan Busfield said this on February 25, 2019 at 8:57 pm
I Believe my mothers Bailey clan were blueys.
Lived on Biddulph Moor all their lives since birth 1937.
Parents Baileys from Leek Lenard and Anne Bailey.
ianrkirkham said this on March 12, 2024 at 8:25 am
my name is stuart bailey my ancestors were from biddulph moor and i would be interested in your family
stuart bailey said this on September 30, 2015 at 9:33 am |
Hello Stuart Bailey, I am a french descendant of some Baileys of Biddulph, I know fromm Rootschat that you have infos concerning several Bailey families of Biddulph. Could you help me find some of my ancestors ? Thanks anyway.
PRA said this on January 18, 2018 at 11:54 am
Hello I have read your mesage, can you tell me who you are looking for and a time period. I will be pleased to help you as much as I can. Stuart
stuart bailey said this on January 30, 2018 at 3:17 pm
Hello,not sure of your name.Can you give me some names and dates of the family you are searching for so that I can reply with the information I have
Many thanks
Stuat Bailey
stuart Bailey said this on January 31, 2018 at 1:18 pm
My Mother is a Bailey and was born on Biddulph Moor 1937. June Bailey.
Her parents also from that area and Leek Lenard and Anne.
ianrkirkham said this on March 12, 2024 at 8:27 am
Hi I was a Bailey for Biddulph Moor.
susan smith said this on July 11, 2017 at 9:09 pm |
Yes, I remember my family speaking of the Pinkies and the Bluies
Mary Williams (granddaughter of a Bailey) said this on August 29, 2020 at 4:59 pm |
The Baileys of Biddulph Moor are my relatives through my mother’s side of the family. Her aunt always told us this story and I dismissed it for a long time. I’m hoping to get myself genetically tested at some point in the future. I find this absolutely fascinating as my mother is very ginger indeed and most of my more immediate family is buried at St Laurence’s Church. I can’t remember the exact bloodline but will follow up with my great aunt to try to work this out. I know my grandfather had a reputation locally as being a strong fighter in his youth and I have always been stronger than many of my peers. I would be very interested to know if this has been contributed to through the gene pool of the parts of my family which originated from Biddulph Moor.
Alex said this on March 11, 2013 at 3:29 pm |
Hi Alex, Thanks for sharing this story with us and please keep us updated with any dna testing you may have done in the future.
Regards Gary
blakemere said this on March 11, 2013 at 4:45 pm |
I am a Bailey of Biddulph too – on my father’s side, with family (great Aunt I think) from Biddulph Moor & grandparents remaining in the area until the 80s. My red hair alas is from henna but I too am intrigued by the Saracen connection. This is an interesting blog I’d like to visit again.
Ruby said this on March 18, 2013 at 5:44 pm |
I’m also descended from Baileys from Biddulph Moor, earliest James Bailey b. about 1697, and many of my ancestors from this area were stone masons too. My father had dark auburn hair. I have a family history website with lots of Biddulph families, any Baileys interested in viewing can go to http://www.josal.tribalpages.com and request an invitation. Regards, Joan.
Joan Salmon said this on May 18, 2013 at 12:29 pm |
I am a Bailey from Biddulph Moor I would be interested in your family website thanks
Susan Smith said this on March 29, 2015 at 8:55 pm |
I too am a bailey whose ancestors lived on Biddulph Moor and would like to share my details with you
stuart bailey said this on September 30, 2015 at 9:35 am
Hi Joan, I have just sent a request to your website!
Charlotte S said this on May 18, 2013 at 6:49 pm |
I’m a Stanway from Biddulph Moor,my father born on Stanway Lane and the road is named after my great grandfather Peter. The legend of our Saracen origins is one that has been past down from father to son in our family for generations and it would certainly set us apart from neighbouring communities.
David Stanway said this on May 19, 2013 at 9:40 pm |
I too am stanway with biddulph ancestors. I’ve wondered how stanway lane was named but the council couldn’t help me. I would love to know how and when it was named exactly. My family tree is on ancestry with my gt grandfather, frank born 1881 to john stanway leaving biddulph to live in stockport where I reside toady.
Sally keane nee stanway said this on April 27, 2014 at 9:43 am |
Interesting website. I’m working on a mini-memoir of a man called Ivor Sutton, who lived just below Top Rd Biddulph Moor, and feel quite engrossed with discoveries about him, and this extraordinary area.
Tricia Durdey said this on December 8, 2013 at 3:27 pm |
Hi Tricia,
I wondered if you know the address that Ivor Sutton occupied as we live in Rudyard Road just below Top Road and our labourers cottages were built in approximately 1814. (Two made into one). I am interested in any history that could be attached to our cottage or nearby.
Graham Baker said this on July 13, 2017 at 3:32 pm |
There is a very similar type of coffin lid in St Giles parish church in Newcastle The knights are known to have had a precerptary at Keele so dont know whether there is any coneection
Michael Cooke said this on December 14, 2013 at 8:47 pm |
Hello fellow Stanway. My maiden name is Stanway and I decend from John Stanway born Biddulph, then from Johns son, Frank born Leek and Franks son, Arthur born Stockport – where I live today. I came across Stanway lane on my hunt for more clues when trying to research my family tree.
How do you know Stanway Lane was named after Peter?
sally keane nee stanway said this on February 1, 2014 at 8:18 pm |
I became intrigued with this legend some years ago and have now written a book based on it. Called “The Dark Men Of Biddulph Moor”, it can be purchased in paperback and for Kindle from Amazon. Bill Siviter
billysiviter said this on February 9, 2014 at 1:20 pm |
Thanks Bill. I will certainly check it out.
charlotte s said this on February 9, 2014 at 6:50 pm |
“woman by the name of… ” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlotte_Sophia_Burne
David Haden said this on February 16, 2014 at 8:32 pm |
My grandfather was a stone mason by the name of Joseph Nixon who lived in Gratton in early 1900’s
sheila aulton said this on June 6, 2014 at 9:39 am |
My dad is a Bailey of Biddulph Moor. He was interviewed some years back about this story, and had a DNA test to find if, indeed, there may be a Saracen connection. The results were..you’ve guessed it…’inconclusive’, so not ruled out! It still remains a plausible tale….
Annaliese said this on April 28, 2015 at 10:35 pm |
Hello my grandfather Joseph Bailey was from Biddulph MOOR I wonder if there is a connection with your family.He married Martha Beech and was the organist at the Methodist Church,he had a brother John who was a violinist with the Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra. I have details of his ancestors and also details of my grandmothers family
stuart bailey said this on October 5, 2015 at 9:12 am |
replying to Analiese as above please let me know of any connection
stuart bailey said this on October 5, 2015 at 9:19 am |
I’m the great, great, granddaughter of Myrick Bailey of Biddulph. It was me who originally contacted the BBC and suggested the topic of the Saracens. My Aunt was DNA tested…result ‘inconclusive’. But who knows? The legend has certainly been persistent. I was told it as a child, and all my Biddulph relations definitely believed it!
Audrey Fussell said this on January 31, 2016 at 10:02 am |
Hello Audrey
I was helped in my Bailey family history research by your late aunt Elspeth. We corresponded for many years . I am a direct descendant of Stephen Bailey who married Elizabeth Shufflebottom in 1837 at Astbury . My Baileys lived on Biddulph moor and after Elizabeth died in 1842 Stephen married Mary Plant also of Biddulph Moor .
Elizabeth Campion said this on January 13, 2020 at 1:15 pm
Hello ,i too had a lot of help and information from Elspeth as my Bailey ancestors came from BIDDULPH MOOR. Also married Beech and Lancaster families .I am the 7 times great grandson of Thomas Bayley who died in 1697 at Beckfields farm BIDDULPH moor and from his will I found he was quite wealthy as he had loaned money to a number of people .Stuart Bailey .
Sent from Sky Yahoo Mail on Android
stuart bailey said this on January 14, 2020 at 9:32 am
I put a reply on here Stuart
Elizabeth Campion said this on January 14, 2020 at 12:50 pm
Thank you Liz for that information, Im still looking to find the baptism of Thomas and his wife Francis and their marriage. Ive looked at the Mormon records but as you have probably experienced they are unreliable,incomplete and sometimes compiled with a bit of guess work.
Stuafrt
STUART BAILEY said this on January 15, 2020 at 10:09 am
Hello Stuart
Elspeth was very helpful to many family history researchers I think . I also had a great deal of help from the late George Plant who was related to us through the marriage of my Stephen Bailey to his Mary Plant .
My Bailey line connects with Cottrell, Salt,Plant,Turnock, Bradbury, Pickford, Mayer, Vyse, Heathcote ,Waller . All Biddulph families I think and Congleton . I’ve been researching them for almost 40 years . I expect we are related somewhere along the line .
Liz
Elizabeth Campion said this on January 14, 2020 at 12:06 pm
Hi Annaliese, Is your Dads interview something we Baileys can view on line?
charlotte said this on April 29, 2015 at 7:17 pm |
Afraid not, Charlotte..I’ve got it recorded on a tape somewhere so will look out for it.
Annaliese said this on April 30, 2015 at 3:26 pm |
Thank you!
charlotte said this on April 30, 2015 at 3:32 pm |
Hi, I’m a direct descendent of the Bailey’s of Mow Lane, Gillow Heath, nestled in the valley between Biddulph and Congleton Edge, but I have been led to believe that the family originated from Biddulph Moor. My great great grandfather Thomas Bailey was a collier (underground coal miner), I expect in the local pit at Knypersley. All his sons, including my great grandfather John Bailey, followed in his footsteps. Thomas is buried at St Laurence’s in Biddulph, with his wife Eliza and several other family members.
One of John Bailey’s sons, my grandfather, also John Bailey, was born and lived in Congleton where he died in 1955, almost six years before I was born so I unfortunately never knew him. Both my grandfather John Bailey, and his only son, my father Arnold Bailey, had quite distinguishing looks and darker than average skin, wavy jet black hair, and were definitely not typical of the average Anglo Saxon, Norse or Celtic races! We do have a smattering of red hair in the family that pops up from time to time too!
Both my brother Stephen Bailey and I are keen family historians and would love to hear of any connections to our branch of the Biddle Men! You will find our respective trees on ancestry.co.uk.
I was made aware of the ‘furriners’ in the family as a young boy growing up in Congleton. My mum used to kid us that my dad was descended from Turks! Not strange then, that I love a lot of things eastern: food, music and architecture for example.
Great to read all this again. Keep up the good work!
Michael Bailey said this on September 11, 2015 at 3:45 pm |
Hey up, we might even be related!! My paternal grandmother is descended from the Baileys- they came from Lask Edge. Other family names are Stanway and Dale. As you know, my Dad was very dark-skinned and could have easily passed for someone of southern Med/ Middle Eastern origin.
Sean said this on March 28, 2016 at 4:07 pm |
Hi Michael, my grandmother was Mary Ellen Bailey of Biddulph, the granddaughter of Myrick Bailey born 1810, and grt granddaughter of Thomas Bailey of Gillow Heath. I inherited an an ‘Adam & Eve’ sampler embroidered in 1847 by Anne Bayley of Biddulph. My aunt participated in the BBC radio programme which investigated the legend. The DNA results were ‘inconclusive’. Coincidence ? both my grandmother and aunt had very pale skin but black curly hair , as does my brother ! Regards
Audrey Fussell said this on May 28, 2016 at 7:54 am |
I think we are related! My grandmother is a bailer from Gillow Heath!
Mary Addison said this on August 20, 2017 at 11:49 pm |
I am interested to contact anyone researching The Bailey families of Biddulph MOOR where my ancestors came from I have traced my line back to the 1700s and there were marriages to the following families, Lancaster, Beech, Nixon,Goodwin,Simcock,Mellor,Wiltshaw,Shelton.My Grandfather Joseph Bailey married Martha Beech.He was the organist at the Methodist Church and one of his Brothers John Bailey was a violinist with the Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra. Both my grandparents are buried in the Methodist Church Yard.
stuart bailey said this on October 1, 2015 at 9:06 am |
Hi Stuart,My dad’s family are from Biddulph and my great grandmother was Sarah Goodwin born 1855, married John Shallcross 1878.
My cousin recently told me that my dad’s mother,their daughter, Hannah Shallcross ‘s family was from Biddulph Moor.I would love to find out more about this .I am tracing my tree on Ancestry. Victoria Horton
Victoria Horton said this on April 25, 2016 at 9:08 pm |
My great Grandad was a Lancaster he was the lay preacher in Biddulph Moor
susan smith said this on July 11, 2017 at 9:20 pm |
Hello Susan,do you have any more information onyour ancestors, as there may be a connection with mine.
stuart Bailey said this on July 12, 2017 at 9:18 am
I was Susan Bailey my Grandma married William Bailey she was a Lancaster her Dad was Lay preacher. My grandma on my mums side was Pricilla Beech her family were from Biddulph MOOR
Susan Bailey said this on February 11, 2018 at 2:10 pm
Hello Susan if you can email me on mowcopman@sky.com with details of dates etc of thepeople involved and some idea of your family tree, Im sure I can help you. There are BEECH and LANCASTERS in mmy ancestry all from Biddulph. Biddulph Moor and Horton
stuart Bailey said this on February 13, 2018 at 2:21 pm
Hi Stuart, My Great Grand mother was Mary Alice Bailey who married Arthur Simon Beech. They moved to Nottingham.
charlotte said this on October 1, 2015 at 11:43 am |
Thanks for that,do you have any more information on Mary and Arthur Simon Beech eg. their parents,where they got married? I,m not sure they are connected to my ancestors,
stuart bailey said this on October 3, 2015 at 8:44 am |
Hi Stuart, Marys father was Earnest Albert Bailey and her mother Sarah Alice. I will have to talk to my mum about more info. Mary my great grandmother was born in 1895.
charlotte said this on October 7, 2015 at 6:51 pm |
Thanks for that
stuart bailey said this on October 9, 2015 at 9:51 am |
I’m also descended from the Baileys and find this legend very interesting. My gt gt gt grandmother was Amelia Bailey, daughter of Thomas Bailey, who married Ralph Horne in 1827. Would love to hear from anyone connected to these families. BTW – lots of auburn hair in my family!
Sam Bourne said this on October 25, 2015 at 2:36 pm |
I too am have ancestors from the Moor and my Baileys go back to the late 1600s.They married into other families from and around the Moor including Horton Parish. My Grandmother was Martha Beech whose father Simon Was Aa stone mason as was his father also called Simon
stuart bailey said this on October 28, 2015 at 10:29 am |
I am the grandson of the late Joseph Bailey and Martha Beech who were both from Biddulph Moor. Interestingly many of the Beech Family were stonemasons and builders, the Baileys were farmers and miners. They both told me of the Saracen connection.
stuart bailey said this on February 1, 2016 at 10:40 am |
I am a direct male descendant of Thomas Bayley/Bailey, baptised 17 Dec 1718 in Marston-by-Congleton, married 2 Jan 1741 in Astbury. My family always understood that it originated from Biddulph. My Y Chromosome is J2, M172, which supports the Saracen theory.
Jonathan Bailey said this on April 1, 2016 at 6:58 am |
Hello Jonathan,my ancestors were from Biddulph Moor and I have a 7x great Grandfather by the name of Thos Baily,father of David Bayley bapt. First of January 1690/91 at Biddulph who married Ellen Bailey at Biddulphn1st April 1716. I gave not found any more details of Thos.Baily other than his wife Francis died 22nd February 1694 at Biddulph. I wonder if there is any connection with your line of the Baily,Bayley,Bailey families.
How did you manage to confirm the Saracen theory?
Stuart Bailey said this on April 4, 2016 at 9:56 am |
Hello Jonathan that is the most conclusive proof that I have seen which suggests that there is some truth in the legend. When were you tested?
I am interested in getting my own DNA tested was it expensive?
Bill Siviter said this on April 4, 2016 at 10:04 am |
Bill,
I had my Y-DNA tested in 2006. Last month, I had my autosomal DNA tested, ie what the rest of me is, except the Y. It shows that my autosomal DNA is 100% northwest European, British Isles or Scandanavian with a bit of southern Europe ( I suspect that was a Huguenot ancestor). Any non-European DNA has long since been filtered out, and I guess that would take a long time, except for the Y-DNA which essentially never disappears and shows that I may have had a male forebear from the Middle East many generations back. Unless, that is, my Y-DNA comes from a very early group of settlers in northern Europe after the Ice Age, and I guess there must be some of those around.
jonathanbernardappleton said this on April 5, 2016 at 6:59 pm
Hi, I have quite a few ancestors from the Biddulph Moor area and I took a DNA test and it came back 99% northern european which was no surprise but 1% came back as Middle East!
Rob JS said this on January 23, 2020 at 12:05 pm |
Hi Rob where did you get the DNA test done I aĺso am a direct descendant of a Thomas Bayley who died in 1697 at Beckfield farm on Biddulph moor
Stuart Bailey
S M BAILEY said this on January 28, 2020 at 9:15 am
Hi Stuart, my DNA results were through MyHeritage, the earliest Bailey ancestors I’ve found so far are a Mary Bailey who married John Lancaster in 1718 at Biddulph, her father was Paul Bailey born c.1655 the son of Randle Bailey.
Rob
Rob JS said this on January 29, 2020 at 12:49 pm
Hi again Rob, I also have an Ancestor from the area called Richard Blackamore!!!!
Martin Docksey said this on May 3, 2021 at 1:35 pm
James,
I am not sure what our connection might be but it sounds highly likely, Thomas, David and Ellen being very common names in my family of the 18th and 19th Centuries..
I wouldn’t say I have confirmed the Saracen theory, I just note that my Y-DNA being J2, which is predominantly Middle Eastern, would be consistent with it. Before I knew of the Saracen theory, I understood that it was from the very first people into northern Europe after the Ice Age, who it seems were also often red-haired. Apparently there are a lot of people in Pitlochry with my Y-DNA. Are you also J2?
Best wishes, Jonathan
jonathanbernardappleton said this on April 4, 2016 at 12:13 pm |
Hello Victoria, the connection I have with the GOODWIN name is that of a marriage of Jane Goodwin to Jonathan NIXON. Jane was born abt.1825 and Jonathan abt 1824. The parents of Jonathan were Jonathan Nixon 1788-1845 and Lois Bayley 1790-1848. I dont have any information of the parents of Jane Goodwin. I have a copy of the will made byJonathan NIXON serior,he was a collier and at the time was living at Greenway (Biddulph) Moor,the will as made on 7th June 1838.
stuart bailey said this on April 28, 2016 at 10:03 am |
Hello Stuart, I can’t match your Jane Goodwin with my family at the moment but I’ll keep checking. I do have a Marie Nixon married to my great, great, great uncle John Parkinson a collier, B 1812, Biddulph. Are you on Ancestry because I have found some trees on their with your names.
Victoria
Victoria Horton said this on April 28, 2016 at 8:59 pm |
Hello Victoria,no I am not on Ancestry but use Genes Reunited.
Stuart
stuart bailey said this on May 2, 2016 at 10:29 am |
My Family come from Selattyn, Nr Oswestry, Shropshire.
The name Selattyn is unique nowhere else in the world as far asi can find out is named Selattyn?
Around doomsday times it was known as Silueridein ( I think that’s the spelling?). When Googled it came up as that name in Sudanese, pronounced “Saladin”.
Is this just coincidence, or is it hint of a Middle East connection?
Any thoughts? Terry Williams.
Terry Williams said this on May 5, 2016 at 9:02 am |
My name is joy and I found out recently that my real grandparents were From biddulph moor called John Thomas Plant and he married a Alice Bailey from Biddulph Moor and they lived on a farm Hurst farm I think. They had three children, but people in Biddulph would only of met one of these children named Joan, who was born in 1921!!. The two boys (one being my father Ernest Brooks) had been adopted. Why? I do not know. But I would love to find out if anyone out there knows of these people as they were my real grandparents (who only died in 1980s) or my real aunt Joan who would be 96 years of age if she is still living. I cannot find a death certificate for Joan. PLEASE anyone out there knows ANYTHING however small I would love to know. I have no living relatives on my father side and would love to meet some descendants!!
I was brought up in church Lawton Kidsgrove and my father Ernest Plant ( birth certificate) was born at arclid to a Alice Bailey and father John Thomas plant from Biddulph moor. He was a poultry keeper as was my father!! Please help as I’ve tried everywhere and I now live in Anglesey due to my daughters cancer. I am 51 and my kids are still young and would love to find some cousins etc.
THANKU so much for reading my heart felt story.
Joy Sidleybrooks.
Joy sidleybrooks said this on July 24, 2017 at 7:32 pm |
My name is joy and I found out recently that my real grandparents were From biddulph moor called John Thomas Plant and he married a Alice Bailey from Biddulph Moor and they lived on a farm Hurst farm I think. They had three children, but people in Biddulph would only of met one of these children named Joan, who was born in 1921!!. The two boys (one being my father Ernest Brooks) had been adopted. Why? I do not know. But I would love to find out if anyone out there knows of these people as they were my real grandparents (who only died in 1980s) or my real aunt Joan who would be 96 years of age if she is still living. I cannot find a death certificate for Joan. PLEASE anyone out there knows ANYTHING however small I would love to know. I have no living relatives on my father side and would love to meet some descendants!!
I was brought up in church Lawton Kidsgrove and my father Ernest Plant ( birth certificate) was born at arclid to a Alice Bailey and father John Thomas plant from Biddulph moor. He was a poultry keeper as was my father!! Please help as I’ve tried everywhere and I now live in Anglesey due to my daughters cancer. I am 51 and my kids are still young and would love to find some cousins etc.
THANKU so much for reading my heart felt story.
Joy Sidleybrooks.
Joy sidleybrooks said this on July 24, 2017 at 7:32 pm |
hi my wife Carolyn was a bailey my son neil has dark olive skin when abroad the locals think he is spanish
michael gregory said this on November 9, 2018 at 9:31 am |
My family were the Nixon’s of Horton. They also lived on Biddulph moor and surrounding areas. A relative of my father’s went to Somerset House in London to research the family tree about 25 years ago, she found we had come from Normandy in France, another cousin from Biddulph moor went to see my father and told him he too had done some research and found that they had descended from the Saracens. I’m currently waiting for DNA Ancestry results. Should prove interesting!
linda Whitehurst said this on December 10, 2018 at 10:25 pm |
Hello Linda, I have connections with Nixon families in my Biddulph Moor ancestors (BAILEYS) and could give you more information with them and other families in my tree i.e. Beech, Lancaster, Mellor, Symcock,Wiltshaw,Jowel,Sheldon.
stuart bailey said this on December 30, 2018 at 11:51 am |
Just to add to my previous message one of my grandmother’s from1840 was a Margaret Bailey.
Linda Whitehurst.
Lindalinda Whitehurst Whitehurst said this on December 12, 2018 at 8:15 am |
There was a cobbler known as Harry Cabbage (surname actually Bailey) who made traditional leather clogs with wooden/metal soles. I grew up on Biddulph Moor and we used to get Harry to make us thick leather watch straps with metal studs :-))). He lived in a tiny low ceilinged cottage on Eliases Lane near its junction with Hurst Road. He had a really bad limp said to be the result of a motorbike accident. He was always great with us (I’d be about 10 in 1977 when we used to go there). Harry did have an olive skin and dark eyes from what I remember.
Jonathan Busfield said this on February 25, 2019 at 8:59 pm |
My name is Lee Oakes. My grandfather Sid Oakes once told me that his cousins (the Slaters from Longton) were from gypsies, and we’re always fighting and getting into trouble with the police. Many years later I researched it out on ancestry and found out that the Slaters Grandmother was Ellen Green born mid 1800s on Biddulph Moor, and she was decended from a line of the Bailey family. My grandfather obviously didn’t realise that he was from the same bloodline. Iv also taken a look at the Slaters marrying into the Gypsy Smith family from Black patch Birmingham. Looking at my name Oakes, and Slaters, Greens, and Smiths there seems to be a pattern of evidence that these families were indeed decended from elsewhere , and what I can only fathom is gypsy clans intermarried with other gypsy clans? Irish and Roma. If it’s anything to go by, in a good summertime (by the standards of a white person) I go as black as a berry lol, and in winter I’m as white as snow! Weird. My wife is also distantly decended from gypsy Jem Mace, the most famous bare knuckle boxer.
Lee Oakes said this on March 3, 2019 at 1:10 pm |
Bailey is a Romany Gypsy surname.
Angela White said this on July 25, 2019 at 12:36 pm |
I have an 1813 large hard cover Family Bible and found an original birth certifcate of an Alice Bailey 1892 Sandbach pasted on one of its pages. I would believe that this Family Bible belonged to the Baileys. Please get in touch with me via email if you are interested.
Casey Smythe said this on October 15, 2019 at 10:19 am |
I would like to see this if possible please my grandfather is jack bailey x
Tracy Bailey said this on June 15, 2020 at 9:16 pm |
Hi i would like to see this as i have a lot of ancestors who came from Biddulph moor and surrounding areas, my grandparents were Thomas and Annie Bailey, my great grandparents were Thomas and Eliza Bailey and Charles Lancaster Boon and Mary Dinah Boon, my great great Grandad was William Bailey look forward to hearing from you Debs x
bloodski said this on January 22, 2022 at 3:19 pm |
My ancestors were the ‘blue clan’ of Biddulph Moor, Bailey’s Hill was apparently named by them. Other Bailey clans included the ‘Pinkies’ and ‘flattances’, which I assume go back to the dark ages.I myself have darkish complexion and dark brown eyes, as did my father, Gary Bailey. My great Grandfather, Wilfrid Bailey was known as ‘Bluey’, and lived in Brown Lees, working as Colliery Under Manager until 1939.We were apprently descended from ‘Big Bill Bailey, a Biddulph Moor cattle dealer.
In 1956, my late grandfather and father made an amazing discovery beneath nearby Rushton Spencer church. To find out the whole incredible story with photos visit ‘Ludchurch; Rushton Church Grave Robbers’ ( I have posted more info at bottom of that page ).Anyone wanting even more detail is welcome to text me on 07926 800 384 ( Rob Bailey )
Rob Bailey said this on December 13, 2019 at 10:44 am |
Hello Rob have you any details of Big Bill Bailey as I have a William Bailey ancestor from Biddulph moor
STUART BAILEY
S M BAILEY said this on December 13, 2019 at 5:37 pm |
I’m decended from a mining family called Nixon, who left Biddulph for the Durham coal fields some time in the 1870s. I think he was William and she was Emma.
Jane Grant said this on October 18, 2020 at 11:28 am |
I spent yesterday in Horton hoping to find more Beech’s in the graveyard than I did . I’m looking for the burial places of Thomas Beech 1851 , Ralph Beech 1808 and John Beech 1847 but no sigh. I’m thinking they could be Biddulph .my tree consists of Hazelhurst’s that went to Canada from Biddulph in 1907 , and Pattysons . My son has now immigrated to Canada and so we have traded his great great great grandparents in Oxbow . Anyone that can help email thanks
Sandy Beech said this on October 18, 2020 at 12:56 pm |
I am descended from Mary Bayley who married Thomas cottrell in Biddulph in 1741. Interesting reading indeed!
Vivienne stokes said this on November 3, 2020 at 2:00 pm |
Not all the Baleys were miners,farmers or masons. My great uncle John Bailey,son of a miner, became a violinist with the Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra. He marrid the daughter of a French Sculptor and played before Sir Malcolm Sargent and other prominent conductors.
Stuart bailey said this on May 11, 2021 at 11:57 am |
Iam a decendant of William Bailey who died June 7th 1932 of Royal Cottage Biddulph we are the Timotheys does anyone else know any of the history of the Baileys
Deborah Blood said this on December 11, 2021 at 3:35 pm |
My great grandmother was a Jane Bailey daughter of Josiah Bailey.My DNA Ancestry analysis shows I have one percent Persian/Iranian ethnicity.
Eric Leese said this on July 12, 2022 at 7:40 am |
My maternal great mother was a Bailey of Biddulph Moor- line tracked back to 13th century with the Bailey stonemasons. Have had my DNA analysed and it is 1% Persian- only explanation can be the Saracen link.
David George Harvey Leese said this on March 14, 2023 at 5:46 pm |
My great-great-grandfather Timothy Bailey was descended from a line of Baileys from the Biddulph area. He was baptised in Horton in 1841. Timothy was noted on one of his daughter’s baptism records as being a ‘Gypsy’. He married Mary Ann Boswell, a grand-daughter of the prominent gypsy, Viney/Solivano Boswell, too. As a result, my DNA profile on ancestry.co.uk locates 5% of its origins among the “Eastern European Roma”. Martin Hill
MARTIN HILL said this on December 10, 2023 at 6:09 pm |
The family name Bailey is considered to be most likely derived from the Anglo-Norman bailli, the equivalent of bailiff. So, if we could find the original bailiff then we would have the link…Oh, wait a minute, what did Sleigh write in 1862?
“One of the Lords of Biddulph, a Knight Crusader, is reputed to have brought over in his train from the holy land a Paynim whom he made Bailiff on his estate, and from whose marriage with an English woman the present race of “Biddle Moor men” is traditionally said to have sprung…” 😉 Martin Hill
MARTIN HILL said this on December 10, 2023 at 6:21 pm |
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ianrkirkham said this on March 12, 2024 at 10:26 pm |
Just a test, I keep trying to reply to this conversation but nothing is getting posted.
ianrkirkham said this on March 12, 2024 at 10:27 pm |
Hi everyone, my mother lived on Biddulph Moor for most of her life (now living in Biddulph). Born 1937 near Horton. Both her parents Leonard and Anne came from the Leek area and moved to Biddulph Moor. Apparently part of the bluey clan.
ianrkirkham said this on March 12, 2024 at 10:31 pm |
One of the most prominent families in Chester during the 13th century was the Saracen family. For example, William Saracen was Sheriff of Chester in the 1230s and Stephen Saracen served in the same office in the 1250s.
I’m wondering if these Saracens came back with Ranulf de Blondeville, the Earl of Chester, when he returned from Egypt in 1220 after participating in the 5th Crusade, as the ‘local mythstorian’, Eli Lewis-Lycett, has proposed on his website. Ranulf de Blondeville was also the High Sheriff of Staffordshire between 1216 and 1222.
Documentary evidence is available showing that members of the Saracen family witnessed documents relating to land transfers and properties, such as the St John’s Hospital, on behalf of the Earl of Chester. And Ranulf de Blondeville’s estates were very extensive. For example, King John granted Newcastle under Lyme to him in 1215. So, perhaps Saracens did appear on Biddulph Moor from time to time during the 13th century.
MARTIN HILL said this on May 13, 2024 at 11:26 am |